Inside The Mix | Music Production and Mixing Tips for Music Producers and Artists

#40: How to be Consistent and Stay Consistent as a Musician | Zak Vortex

August 16, 2022 Zak Vortex Season 2 Episode 17
Inside The Mix | Music Production and Mixing Tips for Music Producers and Artists
#40: How to be Consistent and Stay Consistent as a Musician | Zak Vortex
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Show Notes Transcript Chapter Markers

Zak Vortex is a Synthwave / Retrowave / Outrun producer from Bristol, UK. Zak’s Synthwave Music is heavily inspired by 80s nostalgia, music, and the films of John Hughes, such as Breakfast Club and Sixteen Candles.

Zak Vortex has enjoyed national radio AirPlay as well as touring with world-famous bands. Zak’s last two singles have been placed on Spotify Editorial playlists.

To listen to the new album Miami Squeeze 2 click here: https://zakvortex.bandcamp.com/album/miami-squeeze-2

To follow Zak Vortex on Instagram, click here: https://www.instagram.com/zak.vortex_music/
To follow Zak Vortex on Facebook, click here: https://www.facebook.com/zak.vortex.synthwave
To follow Zak Vortex on Spotify, click here: https://open.spotify.com/artist/775xmJpCXumeGR9V78MkI0?si=7MTF3e-YTqO0rWL_eX7YTQ&nd=1
To follow Zak Vortex on Bandcamp, click here: https://zakvortex.bandcamp.com/
To follow Zak Vortex on YouTube, click here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCY_W4EFz5TNS1t933X3M-WA 

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Marc Matthews:

You're listening to the inside the mix podcast with your host, Mark Matthews. Hello, and welcome to the inside the mix podcast. I'm Mark Matthews, your host, musician producer, and mix and mastering engineer you've come to the right place. If you want to know more about your favorite symp music, artists, music engineering, and production songwriting, and the music industry. I've been writing, producing, mixing, and mastering music for over 15 years. And I want to share what I've learned with you. Hey folks. Uh, welcome. To the inside the mix podcast. In this episode, I'm very excited with this one, actually, to, to, to welcome our guest Zach vortex. Now for the audience listing. Um, Zach was the very first guest on the inside the mix podcast way back in 2021. I think the interview was in January. So, uh, the, the very, very first guest out of, uh, on this podcast. So I'm excited to have Zach back. So if you haven't listened to that episode, I'm just gonna go through a. Um, bio for Zach. So Zach is a synth wave retro wave outrun producer from Bristol, UK. Shout to Bristol great sea Zach's, uh, synth wave music is heavily influenced by eighties nostalgia music in the film, uh, films of John Hughes, such as breakfast club. He's gonna share with us his journey as a producer, since episode one of the podcast. As I previously mentioned the story of his life vibe, uh, side project Chrome waves, the creation of Miami squeeze two and what the future has in store for Zach. So Zach, thanks for joining me today and how are.

Zak Vortex:

Uh, it's a pleasure to join you and, uh, yeah, very good. It's lovely. Nice warm day in Bristol today. And, uh,

Marc Matthews:

yeah. All is good. Fantastic. Yeah. As I said there, so you were the very first interviewee on this podcast, so way back when, and it's, it's been a while and you've been incredibly busy. Um, so I'm looking forward. As I said, offer to sort of digging in and getting the behind the scenes look into to what you've been up to, man, cuz I see you releasing music left right. And center in various guyses as well and collaborations. And I know there was talk of taking it on the live circuit as well. So. What I wanna start with really is, uh, is your life since the first episode. So when I first spoke to you, uh, you'd released, uh, Miami squeeze. If I remember rightly yes. That

Zak Vortex:

just come out that had just come out. Yeah.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah. And, um, most recently you've released Miami squeeze too. So you've had a wealth of successful releases that, to be fair. Can you sort of share with our audience, the secret behind your prolificness, so how you are able to come up with these amazing tracks, amazing albums. So in, in such a prolific manner,

Zak Vortex:

I think I sort of treat it almost. Um, I have really, I always set goals of a goal driven, so I always have an idea at the start of the year, what, where I wanna be at the end of the year. And, um, when it comes to sort of the creativity. That's what comes in peaks and trough. So if like, if I, so when I'm feeling very creative, like at the moment I'm next, it just seems to be clicking. Dunno if the same. So I'm just doing as much and of sounding I want. But then also I just don't sleep so do not sleep and do music, but, um, and that's not true, but I, yeah, I've got two kids as well. Um, obviously married, so I have a lot of sort of, and a, and a job, like most people. So I, I have, uh, I don't have a lot of spare time, but when the sort kids are in bed, I, I spend a lot of my time. As I say, I treat it almost like a job. So I either spend a lot of time creating music or creating for social or cocreative creative around the Zack vortex brand. If you wanna call it.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah, it's interesting. I like the, the idea of the peaks and troughs, cuz it's something I certainly experience and you've gotta sort of strike by eye and it's hot. Haven't you? When you have those creative ideas and those creative juices flow and you just gotta go through it and get in there. So when, when that does happen, if you do go through an extended period of time where you're in a trough, do you have like a tool or a tactic to get you out of said trough,

Zak Vortex:

to be honest, the, the tool or the tactic was Chrome waves. When I was in a sort of Sy wave trough, um, I'd built up. So I've listened to like hiphop all of my life since, uh, like, so I was an eighties child. I grew up listening to sort of nineties hiphop and, and always sort of dabbled a little bit in, um, in be, be making. And, um, I found that when I sort of wasn't feeling too creative Sy wave or too inspired that that's how Chrome wave started. I just started revisiting some of those sort of old beats had put together over the last, I dunno, 10 years or maybe more and found that that seemed to form into songs pretty easily for me. So, so now I've created a bit of a backlog of tracks there, which is good. But now I'm sort of doing the same with Zack vortex. So Chrome waves are not writing anymore for Chrome waves, but I am sort of really in a sort of flow at the moment for Zack vortex.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah, amazing. So I think I saw correct me if I'm wrong, but I saw a post say Miami squeeze three. So you you've only just got, sort of got the Miami squeeze two, but now you're writing, as you said, I think you mentioned it just then actually about Miami squeeze three. So it goes back to that prolificness as well. So sort of striking where the irons hot

Zak Vortex:

weirdly with with that I have, um, I've sort of abandoned the Miami squeezed three idea. Um, cuz as I, as I was writing it. It did it clearly, wasn't going in a direction that sort suited that trilogy, if that makes sense. So therefore I've sort of decided to make it completely standalone more of a, sort of your traditional type of project. That just seemed way the creativity, no sense. Trying to shoehorn it as part of that trilogy.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah. That does make sense. And it perfect sense really? Doesn't it not to try and. I think if you, I think that's possibly one way that you can get into these, I'm using the word trough a lot here, but you can get into these troughs is by trying to shoehorn and create music when it's just not there. So you have an idea or a concept. And then you sort of try and force the creation and in doing so I dunno about you, but I either lose, well, I lose interest, um, quite quickly or get bored. And it's probably not the highest quality of material that I could create because I'm trying to force something. I dunno if you agree.

Zak Vortex:

Yeah, I totally, and that's from, that's been the case in all the years, I've been making music. So often in my band that I was in before this we'd, we'd sort of join band practice together and say, wow, we're gonna write a song tonight. That sounds a bit like queen is a stone age and nothing would happen. Um, it seems that the more pressure you put on yourself and the more you think it's gonna be of a certain style, it it's the harder it is. Creativity, creativity, creative wise. So yeah, quite often what I found with this is it just wasn't working that way was going a different way and I've just sort of embraced.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah, the, the, I, I had the exact same experience when I was in a band. Um, so I echo that in terms of you go there and you're like, right, we're gonna write the heaviest track we can. And, and we either end up getting leaving early because you can't think of anything. Alternatively, we just go off on a total tangent. Um, and that's usually when the drummer starts just doing a random drum film for about half an hour where we just. Racking brains in terms of what to do. So totally echo that and, and I've been there. So the next thing

Zak Vortex:

in the next practice you'll that someone just has a little bit of an idea of a riff and it will just into something right before your, in one practice. You just can't that. And I think if you try to that's when you'll come unstuck.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah, I agree. And once again, I've been there where you somebody's just playing a random. Like going back to the heavy riff analogy and it's not a heavy riff per se. It's just a riff. And you're like, actually, yeah, that sounds great. Or a baseline or a drum fill or a vocal vocal leading. You're like, it's not what we are going for, but because there's that freedom of expression and creativity, it sort of leads you in a nice organic direction. Um, Yeah, excellent stuff. So what I wanna move on to next is, uh, is, is, is vortex map record. So you, you set up your, your record label. So an independent synth wave, low five vapor wave label and music marketing expert. So what was the, so you're releasing your own music, um, under this label, what was the ultimate goal or what was the first goal for this particular.

Zak Vortex:

Yeah, it's not, um, it's a good question. Now. It hasn't, I haven't progressed it as due to time more than anything. So I do have ambitions for it. And I, and I do intend on having a sort of compilation album coming out fairly soon, um, that the workers started on that. The marketing side of things has been successful, but I've dialed it back in all honesty. Cause I have recently started a new job in, uh, sort of in the Bristol city center and, and something's had to give timewise. So like the vortex thing is something I'm passionate about, but at the moment, it's very much on hold, but watch this space is what is what I'll say. But as to when I don't dunno at the moment, just. Time as you, you can imagine. I am time poor when it comes at the second. And, and that's the thing that has probably had to sort of put, be put in a back burner, all.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah, I'm not surprised. I mean, like I said, having look at your, having looked at your Instagram and going back to what I said earlier about the prolificness of how you release material. I'm not surprised something have to give, you know, in terms of you, you've got a day job, you've got a family, you've got 2, 2, 2 art, you've got two sort of, um, artists names then that you're releasing under. So I'm not surprised something's gotta give in an ideal world. Um, V vortex VA records is, is up and running. Um, as, as you want it to be, do you think you would take on artists?

Zak Vortex:

Yeah, absolutely. That's absolutely the, the long term plan. Yeah. And I have, I've spoken to a couple of artists and yeah. There's conversations happening, so that's absolutely to way work less hours, but yeah, those confrontations are happening for sure. At the moment with, uh, a couple of artists.

Marc Matthews:

Amazing. So I'm gonna put you on the spot here. Now. It, it, once again in this, this scenario where the record label's up and running, it's doing well and you're taking on artists. What, what would you look for in an artist to go onto your record label? Um,

Zak Vortex:

it, it's hard for me. It's hard, I guess, to, to know, to know that I, I I'm certainly, um, not biased as to whether it's got vocals or whether it's instrumental that I like both equally. I just anything that makes me feel that nostalgic feeling. That's the, that's the reason I love Sy wave it's I think I said to you last time, there's not been a lot of excite music. That's excited since the sort of nineties and Sy wave. Cause it gives me that sensation everyone sort yearns for. So I guess it's an artist that, that get, that gives me that feeling, I guess. And, and I guess an artist that. I'll be confident we'll release regularly. Cause that, that seems to be important in the sort of modern TikTok world we live in. But so not, not a particular sound, but just something that.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah. Um, I think what you said there about releasing consistently, uh, is, is key, cuz I've, I've noticed that. And um, I know we were chatting off air about being busy and I've sort of been busy behind the scenes myself and, and it's one of those, I think I've set out on the podcast a few times about content being king, really in terms of, and I think you mentioned it just now, whereby if you're not writing, you are producing content to. Put out there to, to promote yourself. Um, and you've gotta be incredibly active, I think, to stay top of mind. And also top of these algorithms, um, in particular, which this kind of leads me on nicely to the next question. Um, or topic rather is the, this is Zack VTX, Spotify playlist, which is no mean feat. It's a big. Congrats on, on that one there would you, I mean, my question was gonna be the contributing factor. Would you say the contributing factor is being prolific?

Zak Vortex:

I, I guess it must be, um, I've done as much research as I think possible on how Spotify's algorithms work. And I have a pretty good idea of how the sort of like when you release a song, I have a pretty good idea what the first sort of three or four days do. And what, what Spotify looks for to push you. Release radar and then into discover weekly and, and got a good understanding of that. But I haven't managed to find anything documentation wise about how you get, uh, this is playlist cause there's certainly artists substantially bigger than me that don't have them. And as artists that do so don't know the answer, I can only say what I've done, which is release extremely regularly. I don't think I've ever gone longer than four weeks. Releasing something. So that's all I can suggest that other than that, I dunno what, what it is that triggers that for me over someone who

Marc Matthews:

hasn't got. Yeah. Um, that's impressive, man. We're releasing every four weeks. I gotta say, I didn't realize it was every four weeks. That is so good. Um, but yeah, I, I, I would imagine as well, they probably move the goal posts quite a lot, and that I think I, I could be corrected on this, but I'm fairly certain the social media platforms do move. I know with Google as well, Google do move, move the goal post a lot. Stay on top of that is. It's tricky. So once again, this is a nice segue into the next question. So I put the, um, put a question out or post out in the, in the community group asking, uh, for individuals to put questions that they'd like to put towards you. So Tim Benson, AKA I or nine, um, big support the podcast. Great producer, uh, had this question. So it's um, he asked what he, Zach, you, uh, Phils the best way to grow your audiences. Is it Facebook, Instagram ads, or trying to get on playlists or radio? Social media or actual live performance.

Zak Vortex:

Uh, that's a good question, Tim. I can, I can, again, I can speak for me and, and what works for me and what I've helped others do. And I, I definitely, I'm very, very passionate about them. We don't need as independent musicians. We don't need gatekeepers. Um, and we, and we shouldn't be using them because, um, I just don't, I think it's counterproductive. So. For me, you want to talk directly to your audience, not via third party. So, but I find, I do find sort of, um, Facebook, Instagram ads are a very effective way to, as long as they're created as conversion ads are not what they call link, click ads. They, they don't really yield any results in my. As I've ever found, but if you do a conversion ad that sort of runs to a, a landing page, I use tone D that works extremely well. Cause you can embed your pixel in there. That is a very good way of, of driving traffic, um, to your new Spotify release or, or whatever it is you want to, um, you want to promote, but I would recommend Spotify. Cause I imagine most people are sort of probably 90% of their streaming activities on Spotify. Um, so, so that's what I think works and, and how much you invest in that is, is totally up to you. Um, as I say, I, I do treat Zach vortex as a business. So I, I do have, when I'm releasing a song, I have a marketing budget in mind and I, I have it already sort of distributed in my mind of where I'm gonna spend money and where I'm not, um, And some, some campaigns go really well and some, some not so well, but certainly, um, that's, that's how I do it. So I, I have, in my mind, I, I won't, I don't aim to be profitable with Zach vortex until 2020, probably. Um, at the moment I sort of without going into too much ball in detail, but I go, I break even at the moment. So any money, the money I make from streaming. On those different platforms pays for the, the marketing campaigns for the next singles. So I about break even, and I'm very happy to run it that way. Um, for the next couple of years, as long as I'm seeing consistent growth, um, what I've discovered is I don't find playlisting or playlist pitching for me. Doesn't work at all. It. You can get on playlists and you do get plays, but I don't see that, that seems to very rarely get your track added to more playlists or more importantly, um, gain new followers on Spotify, which I've found for me is one of the keys is I've. I've got, I think it's, um, nearly 8,000, I think followers on Spotify. And I think that's one of the keys, because then when I do release music, every four weeks, I get quite a large. Bump from release radar. Cause everyone follows. You gets given your track in their release radar. So I've given you a lot of information there, but, but to answer Tom's, uh, original question it for me, it's, um, it's using Facebook and Instagram ad campaigns work, but you, you do have to be smart with it and know when to cut your losses and, and know, and a lot of it's about AB testing as well. I find that I can have a minute snippet of a certain part of a track. That performs really well. And I do it and I'll AB test it with another bit of track that doesn't do so well. And there is a bit of tinkering, so it's not, it's not fainted in a way. Um, as I've said before, my background is marketing, um, digital marketing. So I'm, I'm fortunate in that area that, that I sort of do to my work. I understand that that marketing world quite.

Marc Matthews:

No, I think, um, don't apologize for the answer, by the way. That was a fantastic answer because on this podcast, I don't think we've ever gone into such a granular in terms of detail, in terms of the business mindset behind music and being a musician. Um, more than not, it's, it's more, it's more to do with the, the creative aspect of it. But I, I love the idea that you you're treating it as a business and you've got this business plan and almost like business model. And you can you forecast when you're gonna, when you're gonna start to be profitable and you're breaking. And I love the idea of the campaign plan as well. Um, cause I do something very similar myself. I, I try, I AB test with content, um, and I've done it with social media. I think by having that plan, it also helps focus your mind. Cuz I know when I started out being in a band years ago and probably when I started out doing music and when I did it solo, a lot of the time I was throwing darts throw basically I proverbial wall and seeing like, okay, it was shots in the dark in terms of what I was doing. I'll try this this week. I'll try that this week and see what happens without any real consistency. And I think having that plan and sticking to it as well and, and riding it out for a bit before you pull the plug on something. Specifically with, with social media marketing as well, in terms of, um, Instagram and Facebook. I think the one technique I, I read up and I tried recently was, I dunno if you've ever heard of it, the, the dollar a day. Um, Facebook a I dunno if you've ever heard of that one before I

Zak Vortex:

have. Yeah, I, I dunno. I can. Well, I can imagine what the premise is.

Marc Matthews:

But, um, yeah, I mean, I've gotta go into great details for the audience on this one, cuz I, you could probably chat about it for the next half hour, um, 45 minutes. But, um, that, that was one example of how I tried something, uh, gave it a bit of time. It didn't work. So I sort of knocked it on the head and moved on something else. I'm sure it would work if I had the content to go with it. But as you mentioned earlier, it's all about time, isn't it? But no, I really like that idea of, of the way you see sack vortex and, and I. The success you are having is sort of like Testament to your plan, really. I mean, the way you planned it is amazing. And, um, hopefully the audience listening will take, take bits of this and actually think, you know, what, if I start to implement these, these campaign models and these ideas and have a, more of a strict flow of what they're doing, hopefully it will, it will turn into some form of success.

Zak Vortex:

Well, yeah, cause that when we, when we first spoke, um, hopefully my, my wife never watches this, but I was. Hundreds, if not thousands pounds on trying diff on what they call it, snake oil salesman. Let's say, no, invest here. We'll give you playlist push. I think one of them's called and we'll. And so if I can, if I can help anyone not waste that money like I did, then then great. Um, and let's say they, some of those things do have a, a very temporary benefit, but I didn't see any long term growth. Investing in things like playlist promoting and that type of thing. I, I think more often than not that type of marketing will, will cause you more trouble than it's worth in all honesty.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah, I would agree. I think I went down that route way back in the beginning. Um, very much like you probably around the same, same sort of time. And, um, I got my fingers burnt on that, so I just never did it again. I was just like, you know what, I'm just gonna, I'm gonna do things. The right way, maybe is the wrong way of putting it because I dunno what the right way is, but I certainly wouldn't, wouldn't go down that route again. And I still, now I dunno about, I imagine you get this a lot, um, with Instagram and in email as well, uh, playlist PO plugs just constantly bombarding me. Saying, um, X, Y, Z, about my, my, I haven't had enough streams. I should have more, I can help you out and do this, this and this. And, um, and the, yeah, it just, it's relentless. You, it is relentless. The amount, the amount of people organized or bots, I guess they are really just contacting you and it's, it's gotta be the, the rule of attrition at some point. Somebody's. Say yes. And I guess, I guess it works for them, you know, which is, which is sad because there's a lot of money is wasted. Yeah. It must,

Zak Vortex:

it must, it must occasionally work for them, I guess. But I, the other, the last thing I would say on it, the, that I've spoken to friends about, and, and I have, when I am doing Forex fan, I have helped and created campaigns for others. I've got a few. Clients across the world. And the one thing I've always been really careful about making sure that they, they understand is to do it, I think properly. And, uh, you won't get overnight results. So you're, you're not gonna suddenly get thousands of streams. Um, if you are doing a, doing a sort of direct cat marketing campaign is gonna be a slow and gradual, but it just. It still snowballs gets bigger and bigger and bigger. Um, but it does, it does take time. And I know clients I've worked with, if I called artists have been disappointed that they've not suddenly got a thousand followers overnight, but definitely won't happen that way unless, well, some artists will, I'm sure. I'm sure some will release something that will go mega on something like TikTok. But I think in general, it's slow and steady if to do it probably in my opinion.

Marc Matthews:

I agree. Um, yeah, I totally agree with that. And I think, um, I've always said like slow and steady wins the race and consistency. And, uh, I read a book rather. I listened to a, a, an audio book, which was the compound effect. And, um, I got this from another business podcast and the idea was that little, well, every day you, you do something that contributes to the growth of whatever it is you are doing. And. Cementing that with a focus of, uh, some form of plan, like you mentioned earlier, and with over time that will compound and that proverbial snowball gets bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger. Um, to the point of whereby I dunno what happens. It just gets continuously gets bigger, I guess, um, until the success happens well. Yeah, exactly. And I've noticed it with the podcast. So, um, I mean, I started Syria. I took about two or three. Break. And then I started series two back in March. I think it was. And we were running at, I mean, I was getting regular downloads and it was somewhere between, I think it was like something like 20, no 15 to 20 downloads a week. And now just via being consistent and. Consistent really releasing. And in the last month, we've I say we it's me. Um, moved to a, a weekly podcast and I now know it is in 70, 80 downloads a week and it's getting more. Yeah, it's amazing. And it's, it's also Testament to the listeners as well. And those who've been on the podcast, you know, sharing it, which is amazing, but it's growing and it's, it's that compound effect. I didn't know what was gonna happen when I started, when I interviewed you way back when. I listen. You didn't know? Would, would anybody listen, um, would, would it grow? Would it, would it become stagnant, but it's, and it's through. It goes back once again to having that plan. And now I've got a plan of action. I've been to podcast school, um, for, for the audience listening, that's inverted quotes, um, and it's helping and it's growing the podcast amazingly over the last two or three months. That's

Zak Vortex:

incredible. Great. You should be really, really proud of yourself. That's.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah, thank you. Thank you. It, I won't lie. When I started a podcast, I didn't realize it was gonna be such hard graft , but it is great. Um, I get to chat to all sorts of people like yourself, all over the world and whatnot, learn, learn a lot. And, um, yeah, the growth by the time this comes out, I'm hoping, I'm hoping fingers crossed. That will be at the stage whereby within the first 30 days, we're getting a hundred downloads on a new episode, which. That that is the goal. And that will put the podcast, uh, fifth in the top 50% of podcasts on the internet. I think it's oh, wow. That's amazing. Oh yeah. I've, I've done my research. Um, much like you earlier, when you said about how you went and did your research in terms of how to, to grow on Spotify. I think what you've said, and what I've just said then is, is Testament to just due diligence, I think.

Zak Vortex:

Yeah, absolutely. And, and to your point earlier about having a. Again, another piece of advice from what, what has worked for me is I've got now in, I use district kid, like a lot of people do to put music on streaming platforms. So I've got a really, I've got a release scheduled every four weeks up February I moment. So I've sort of lays focused. What that looks like for the next few months ahead, which is how I like to operate. If I can,

Marc Matthews:

let's take a quick break from this episode so that I could tell you about free resource that I made for you. It's a PDF checklist that describes what you need to do to properly prepare a mix for mastering. So you've done the hard work and you love your mix yet. Suitably preparing a mix for mastering is often overlooked by. Resulting in delayed sessions, excessive back and forth conversation and frustration on both parts. I want to help fix that. So if you want this free resource, just go to www dot synth music, mastering.com. As this checklist will help and guide you to make the mastering process as smooth, transparent, and exciting as possible. So again, the URL is www.sy music, mastering.com for this free preparing a mix for mastering checklist. Let's get back to the episode. That's fantastic. Um, what would be really cool? Cause I've got similar process in place for the podcast I've got, uh, I think I've got interviews now recorded, lined up, which will take me up until Christmas. Oh, fantastic. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's amazing. It's amazing. How time goes quick, so quick. Um, But it'd be great. Uh, I don't, it might not be another podcast episode, but I'll get in touch around that sort of time and see, and like report back on growth and see where we're at. I think that'd be quite cool to do. Yeah. Okay. Sounds good. Let's do that. Yeah. Yeah. Well, we'll discuss that more there. Um, I don't wanna boil the listeners without, without bit of metric. Um, so that kind of moves on nicely then. So we'll get back to like the music side of things now. So let's, uh, chat about Miami squeeze too. So can you tell our audience a bit about Miami squeeze two and how it falls follows on from Miami squeeze and what they can sort of. Yeah. So

Zak Vortex:

it's, it, it, it's it for me, it's the logical follow on to that album, which is why I decided to go with it as a sort of, almost like a sequel. Um, it consists of. A lot of new ideas, but it also consists of some older ideas that I'd had that were beyond my production capability at the time that I wasn't able, um, to pull off the way that I had in my mind. Um, and, and people like yourself that do these really educational posts and videos of being absolutely essential, uh, for me. So when I'm not like making music, I am studying it as well, because I don't confess to. To be the best producer in the world far from it. Um, I think I'm a good songwriter. So I think that's been that's that's the foundation anyway, like the best production in the world. Isn't gonna do that much for you, if you haven't got a good song, idea or basis there. Um, so I've, since we last spoke, I've spent a lot of time trying to learn the craft of music production and, and, and you are one of the best around, so you'll you'll know, it's, it's a complicated thing. Sound design. Mixing and getting learning about frequencies and where to put them. So, uh, it it's the, so the album is the, the logical sort of sequel. Um, and let's say it's a collection of ideas that didn't go onto the first Miami squeeze, because I, I wasn't skilled enough to make them how I wanted them. And, and I've also within there is I've included a couple of my bigger songs, like, uh, neon rain and Kelly Labat that have had a lot of success, but I've never been on an album. So I tho those went on as sort of bonus tracks as remastered bonus tracks as well. And, um, yeah, the take up on, on band camp has been absolutely mind blowing. Um, I, I dunno how and why it's been the way it has been, but it's certainly a, a nice problem to discover, to have, um, even more so than the sort of Spotify streaming, the sort of sales on band camp has been yes. Say mind. It's it's certainly been very well

Marc Matthews:

received. I was gonna say, I've seen them mate. I've seen when you've posted on Instagram and, um, and when you, with the updates, I'm like, wow. I mean, absolutely smashing it on bang.

Zak Vortex:

Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's been in the top eight Sy wave album, I think solidly, since it released, um, a months ago, it's never dropped out. It's incredible. I, I dunno why, but, um, but I'm really

Marc Matthews:

happy. It's. No, no, you should be mate. It's it's well deserved. And thank you. Thank you. Uh, for the, um, the shout earlier, when you mentioned about production video, so appreciate much appreciated. It's quite a new venture for me,

Zak Vortex:

type thing, watching money or post recently about.

Marc Matthews:

Oh mate, I love side chain. I've got a release coming out on Tuesday, the 28th of June and, um, there's side chain all over the place and there, I just went I went to town on it. I was just like, you know what? I've gotta, this is gotta be an EDM track side chaining, but no, I I'm a big advocate of that. So audience listing, go and check out my, um, I think it's episode 32, I think. Um, but you'll see it, it says side chaining in there. What do you think is the biggest. Development in your production sort of skill set that has helped you go to the next level in terms of those songs that you mentioned, that you, you thought you didn't have the requisite skills at the time, but you do now. What was the biggest development,

Zak Vortex:

uh, eing for without doubt? Um, realizing it's a lot more complicated and essential than I think I'd given it credit for in my first couple of releases. So really. Researching listening to the greats, finding out, not just in Sy wave as well. I've done. I've watched a lot of videos of producers that, that worked on blurs records, racist records of dance records, just understanding their approach to the, against the kick and, and you like the sort of mid ranges with the pads. Just, just learning more and more. And I don't think you ever learn it all, but. It's definitely been in the EQing and learning the importance of that, like that. I don't confess to be an expert there, but I think if, if you listen to the next that's coming out, that's pay you'll big in the, from say Miami's a significant difference in, in the sort of EQing

Marc Matthews:

that I've been. Yeah, EQs massive. And I think I went through a similar thing a few years back. And then, um, because frequency balancing, I think two or three years ago was, well, it was kind of like, uh, I, I need to develop this. And I think if you listen to releases, I probably did years ago compared to what they are now. Like you said, you go away and you learn you. You never, you never master everything you never do with music and music and music engineering, a production, but EQ is huge. Uh, do you use, do you use, uh, mid side EQ at. Uh,

Zak Vortex:

I dunno what that is. So no,

Marc Matthews:

that's alright. No worries. I just wondered, I just wondered

Zak Vortex:

this means you've got a video coming outta of that.

Marc Matthews:

Ah, wow. Well, this is it. I'd like to say that was a really, really good plug for me, but it's not, that was just off the cuff, but I am now gonna do, I'm gonna make a note about I'm leaning over here, you mid side cue. Um,

Zak Vortex:

yeah, but I'm gonna, as soon as we stop talking, I'll look, I'll look that up. So, but yeah, it's just the reason I've sort of revisited ideas is. They sounded too muddy the mixes before. And I was like, that's just not how it's meant to sound and having watched videos about, but the better low frequencies for sub base and where your kick fits in that has just made the, all the world of difference, which is why I've been able to revisit them and, and probably why they've been accepted so well on Miami squeeze.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah, it's huge. I think frequency, juggling and balancing those frequencies is massive, specific quite obviously, across the whole frequency spectrum, but in the low end, I think that's where you can lose a track a lot where you've got so many things going on, you've got your basic kick. Um, you might have, uh, a low sort of synth up or something like that. And if they're all competing for space, you just can do this incredible spike in this, this boxy and this route. That's booming us and yeah. Uh, audience listening, I think echoing was said there about EQ understanding E. Is is paramount, I think, to a successful production and then maybe maybe compression there afterwards, but, um, it's subjective.

Zak Vortex:

Yeah, it's a good shout compression I've invested in, in more in, uh, in compressors as well. Um, so. There's a couple of, I've got a couple of waves, compressors that seem just to work well with me. Um, sometimes I, I quite like their presets as well. Um, I dunno if presets is a dirty word to pro like you, but sometimes I can use them as a start and tweak them, but certainly compression is another area where I've definitely invested a lot of my time.

Marc Matthews:

No, no, I'm, I'm all for presets mate. Uh, I mean, I've got, um, I'm doing like behind the minute, long behind the scenes of my latest track. And in three of those, I talk about presets and how I had this preset sound and I just went in and tweaked it. And I think some, I think it goes back to what you said earlier about gatekeepers. Um, and I think there are in, in audio engineering and production, there are gatekeepers. And as soon as you mention the word preset to them, they were just immediately. Like just shut you, shut you down. I mean, there's no, there's no harm in it. I don't see this. Why, why reinvent the wheel? If it already exists, you know, why make your life more difficult? Why they somebody's created this to help you? why not use it? That's my thought process on it. No, I totally specifically, yeah. With VSDs when it comes to compression or EQ or, um, or if you're using, um, a synth emulation, if somebody's already created the sound, just go in and tweak it. Um, yeah, I just don't understand why you would, why you would shut that down. It's.

Zak Vortex:

I, I think I've, I've said to people before, when they've, when I've had conversations about, oh, that you are using like VTS and not real analog hardware and, and stuff like that. And if your goal is to impress your peers, then, then fantastic. Go for it. Invest thousands pounds in, you know, synthesizers. I, I would never knock you for it. And if I had the money, I would do the same. But, but you need to again think about who is the end audience will, will they care and will they know? And, and it goes back to what said, I still think the key though, is the song structure, song development, and, and designing music and layering. That just goes well together. Song, structure. I think learning those crafts, um, is the, is the first thing to learn for sure. Because without that basis, You all curing in the world and all the compression in the world, isn't, isn't gonna make it a great track. It just make it a really well produced, bad track.

Marc Matthews:

yeah. Very true. And I think going back to your story about band camp, success and Spotify, I cannot imagine your listeners, um, have got in and thought or potential listeners have got the thought and an investigator, whether or not you use analog or virtual Sy, you know, you might get the old one. The the old one in a few thousand, but I mean, at the end of the day, you've still got X amount of others who are listening to your material. You know,

Zak Vortex:

when it taking vortex on looks like I've got, have hardware and analog hardware, and I do use it for live rehearsals. But for me and I have recorded, there is a track on Miami squeeze, two called always remembered me. That's all all done with analog, uh, since, uh, other than the drums, everything else is analog recorded in a pain. If I, you don't have any of the, any of the benefits of been able to just move notes around, you've gotta then even if you're using MIDI with your analog, you've then gotta rerecord it again with the new MIDI notes. No, not for me. I, I think I read time cop said something similar the other day, but when it comes to me recording in a door, I'm gonna use, uh, this

Marc Matthews:

STS. Yeah. I'm with you there. Uh, like, like you said, I mean, if I could have a room full of. Vintage sense. I totally would. But what I'd end up doing is just probably spending a day tinkering on them and not actually record anything and then go to my laptop or my desktop, whatever its I'm using and actually just use the, the emulation I have cuz it's it's easier and it's my workflow and it's what I'm used to. Yeah,

Zak Vortex:

exactly. But I wouldn't knock anyone. I knows a guy. I think that's, as I say more voice, he he's got a lot of analog equipment and it sounds awesome. And he's a fantastic.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah. I saw a post. Um, he put out earlier today, which was about, um, a song that he's produced or, or an album he's producing, which is purely just using his analog since. And, uh, it's, his productions are, are amazing, man. Yeah, they are.

Zak Vortex:

Yeah. Yeah. And I, and I, no doubt we'll buy that, I think, cause I can't wait to have a listen to

Marc Matthews:

it for sure. Vocal production is very, very good as well. So audience listening, go and check more voice out and, um, tell him that we sent you as well. Yeah, he's very

Zak Vortex:

good. Very good. An songwriter

Marc Matthews:

for sure. Yeah. It's got really cool content as well. He's got really nice aesthetic with the, with the content he puts out.

Zak Vortex:

Yeah. He's annoyingly good at all of that. And I think he made a pop. Uh, I think he said pop video then sound like my dad, but he, he made a music video. That's the word? I dunno if you saw that, that was except.

Marc Matthews:

No was that for the late, I heard the latest release, which was fantastic. Is it for

Zak Vortex:

the latest release? Yeah. You check that. We can check that out really, really impressive on, on his YouTube

Marc Matthews:

channel. I'll do that after this cause the song's fantastic. Absolutely. Fantastic. Um, so maybe going back to your sort of music here on my iPad's thrown wobbley here. Um, So can you, this is, this is circling back to a previous release now. So you did a collaboration, true colors. Um, can you, can you tell us a bit about the, the story behind how that collaboration came together and why you chose that song? Well,

Zak Vortex:

the song it's one of my, and my wife's favorite songs. Um, everyone likes that song don't they really, um, And I remember saying to my wife and it was, we were watching MTV or one of those channels and it came on and I said, that would work really well as a simple wave track. Cause I started picturing a piano as a, so I literally just sort. When it finished when it started putting it together and weirdly it was, um, Nina who said, oh, Lao's a huge, I hope I'm saying her name. Right. I really do think it's, um, or is a huge fan of that track. So I just reached out to her and said, look, I've got this music, have a, listen. I know you like the track. And it went from there. Um, she came back. She likes the way she did it. She she's so good. She's such a professional that she said. Yep. I'm I'm just knows. Sounds inspirational. And vocal vocals. I dunno. Um, if you had a chance to sort of give that a listen really exceptional, really exceptional, um, minded and the sound of it. Remind me a lot. Of sort of the stuff she'd done with Nina, um, the Sy album, it had that sort of vocal production production that, that I, that I'm used to with Nina records. So I'm, yeah, I'm really proud of the way that came out and, um, yeah, really, really, uh,

Marc Matthews:

happy with that. No, it's a fantastic song and yeah, I've li listened to it numerous times. Cause it is one of those it's account. It's it is a time to song isn't it? The original and hearing an adaptation of it is always fantastic. So my question, sort of a, an ad hoc question there, you mentioned that you, uh, you're working with, I think it is Lao. I'm gonna go with that. Um, cuz there is a, there is a book by an author called Lao and it's pronounced that way. So I've gotta run with that as well. Um, So you mentioned about being in a band earlier and how you've been in an environment whereby you bring ideas together and you write, so having worked collaborated on this sort of Zack vortex venture with Lao, um, did you find that it's a process that you'd like to do more often? Um, in did it, because I dunno about you, but I, I like producing on my own, but sometimes I miss having that element of being able to bounce ideas back and.

Zak Vortex:

Yeah. Oh for, yeah, definitely. And it, it sort of forces you sometimes a little bit out of your usual comfort zone and it forces you to, to do it, do it, just, uh, try a bit harder. Dare I say it. Um, maybe you do, maybe you come complacent. Um, I really, without sound arrogant. I, I was really happy with the guitar side on that track, but it was really loud. It was saying, no, no, no, that's not quite right. You need it. It needs to go at the end of the song. And it needs to be more like this. And, and it was, yeah, it was, I, I enjoyed having, having that back and forth with someone that's sort giving advice and, and, and then it was the same, the other. Uh, and we I've got, um, I'm in the middle of a, a collaboration. I don't do many, but I'm in the middle with a, a collaboration with really, uh, talented Sy wave, uh, duo from America. Uh, I won't name them at the moment, but, um, that sounding really good as well. I'm really happy with, with the work they've done to the sort of bare bones of a track I've sort of sent over to. So I don't, I don't do it a lot, but I have always enjoyed it. Um, and, and maybe who knows maybe the album after this one might be all fo collaboration. So I know a lot of artists do that. I think, uh, there's definitely, you're gonna be less prolific that way. Obviously there's a lot more back and forth, but, um, I think that seems like the logical next step for me.

Marc Matthews:

Exciting mate. I'm looking forward to that. I think. With vocals. What, what you said that when I think when you stick vocals on a track, it does high find. If I, if I have an instrumental, I could put that out quite, quite quickly or create it. But when, as soon as vocals go on, um, that's, it, it that's me locked away for a good month. trying to, trying to get the vocals. Right. Um, it can take so long, but the collaboration sound exciting. Yeah. And

Zak Vortex:

then, like we were saying earlier, when it comes to the EQing and the mixing and vocals, it's, it's a whole new level of complexity. I I found at least maybe not for everyone, but to get, to get vocals, that sound like song ready. I found to be a real struggle. It's taking a lot of time and a lot of practice.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah, I totally agree. And I think what the key I as well with that is getting a writer source. I think if you can get the vocal writers source to begin. Um, if you've got a vocal that's tricky, then you're already on the back foot and it's, and it can be quite quickly evident. Um, but it's hard live vocals. I spent so, so long, um, editing and getting really granular with it. And mixing vocals is probably the most time consuming part of a mix I would.

Zak Vortex:

And maybe, and maybe that's why I haven't done many to date. Um, but yeah, I definitely is definitely in the future intend or do.

Marc Matthews:

No, that's exciting, mate. I'm looking forward to hearing that. Um, it's, it's gonna be great. I think the collaboration sound exciting as well. And going back to what you said there about when you collaborate and it sort of forces you outside of your comfort zone. I think that's a great thing to say as well, because I've noticed one thing, um, that, because I work. Solitary most of the time I bounce ideas off other producers. Like, can you gimme a bit of feedback on this? But I think it's quite easy to get a bit stagnant. Whereas when I was in a band and I'd turn up and like the other guitars would come up with a riff and I'd be like, oh man, um, I can't act, I'm not that good. I cannot play that yet. um, and it forced me to get better and I think working solitary at the moment. Sometimes that can happen where I'm not forced into getting better. I dunno if you think that hundred

Zak Vortex:

percent totally agree it it's so useful having that, that other person saying you've got, you've got bit more in the, you can, you can do that a bit better, but, and also sort of song structure and stuff like that. Cause sometimes you can cause like you say, I work quite ins as well. And sometimes you find on a minute, I'm just doing sort of zap Forex by numbers at the moment I'm doing intro. Like bridge drop. I've gotta actually get myself out of this sort of loop that I found myself in and doing it with collaborations is, is a good way of doing, making sure that you are keeping fresh and you're getting new ideas when it comes to the sort of song structure.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah, most definitely. I had a similar, um, situation recently. I sent a track off to, um, a producer called RO otra who, who checked out, um, what I was doing. And he said exactly what you said there he's like, mark. It sounds really, really good, but I think you could, you've got it in the tank. I think those were his words to take it just that bit higher. Um, um, and you need that. I think sometimes otherwise I just been like, yeah, that's it. I'll do. I'll um, I'll tick that one off and, and move on. But I think. The great thing about synth wave, retro wave outrun, and the whole synth ethos is the collaborative aspect of it. Not just in terms of music, but also in terms of like networking and sharing of content. And I say it every on every episode and I think it's just amazing the amount of support you can get and the lack of gatekeepers as well in a good way.

Zak Vortex:

Oh yeah. Cause I went see, um, Ollie ride in London. Um, I think it was just the end of last year. Was it early this year? I can't remember. And I met so many symp that I'd seen, um, like on social media and everyone's so charming, so lovely. Um, definitely drank too much with them, but, um, there was, yes, it in I've. Yeah. It's such a nice environment was such nice people and, and the gate keeping thing is easy, easy to avoid. Yeah,

Marc Matthews:

definitely. It definitely is. And it's not necessary. I don't think we, you get gatekeepers everywhere it's gonna happen, but I think you can easily avoid them in this particular sort of genre of, of music. Um, so Zach, what I wanna move on to next is like what the future holds for you. So you mentioned earlier about life performance, and I know you earlier in the year, there was a gig booked. Um, didn't quite happen for, for whatever reason, but is that something that you're gonna look into doing in the, in the near future? It, it

Zak Vortex:

is. Is, but what, what I haven't worked out yet is what live Zack vortex is or sounds like, or looks like. Um, I've, I've seen a lot of Sy artists live now. Um, and of course I'm not gonna name ones, I mean, and are quite underwhelming, not their music, but they're not playing live. Um, they're moving a couple. Twiddling a cup knobs every now and then. Um, and then you've got all the way up to bands like the new arcades, those bands, full experience, mind blowing, definitely myself, more that side of things. Um, so I, so it's definitely on horizon. I just don't quite know at the moment what it looks. I've got friends around Bristol area, good musicians that, that I think would be willing, who have said they'd be willing to be a part of a, a Zack vortex live show. So it's definitely on a, on a horizon I've, uh, I've spent decades performing live and, and although I certainly what I didn't have kids and stuff like that back then, but, um, It's definitely something I, I, I miss, I think you always miss it a bit. I doubt I'll ever be giggling every week. Like I used to as a, a younger guy, but, um, I'm yeah, I'm looking forward to doing a few shows. Whether there'll be this year, I'm not, not sure.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah, I, I, I echo that sentiment. Um, it's one thing I miss about music is performing life it's, uh, that feeling of is, is amazing and it, and that, that yearning for it. Doesn't, doesn't go away. And I think you're in a fantastic city to be in as well for like creators and performers in Bristol having lived there. Um, you, you you're very, um, Blessed, I would say in terms of the, uh, the musicians, I would imagine that your sort of, disposal's probably the wrong word. Um, it probably is

Zak Vortex:

the wrong musicians at my office that, that are interested and we are talking about what it, what it might be. I definitely like the idea of real drums having seen sort wide show and. Something, and I've seen M a T three do similar. I know, uh, maybe it's not quite Sy, but it's in that ballpark that, that real base, real, real, basic guitar, real drums with Sy, which just sounds fantastic. So I think that's what it would be like. I think it would be a full band experience. Um, the will take a little bit of rehearsals organiz. I don't see, I never see me stood on my own on, in the middle of a stage of sympathizer. I, I just can't see that being something anyone would wanna see or I'd be comfortable doing.

Marc Matthews:

Yeah. I I've always liked to be on stage with others. Yeah. That you can bounce off of. I don't think I'd ever wanna be on stage on my own unless I was talking. And then I'd do that. But I dunno who would wanna see me on stage just talking, but yeah, yeah, of course.

Zak Vortex:

I've I've done. I've been, yeah, I've done that too, but I. I'm just putting myself in the, um, in the audience shoes and thinking about what, what I'd like to see. So I think, I do think those act vortex songs with a full band sounds like that could sound good. So that's, that's the plan

Marc Matthews:

that's exciting. And it it's, um, it echoes, I interviewed Dan from Pensacola mist, uh, last week, I think it was, and he said the same thing about their live act that they don't wanna. Perform their songs. Um, like you said, that you could, you could, you could essentially just have Ableton and then you, you could, or whatever it is that you want to use and just play and move some bits, fade between tracks and stuff, but they wanted this whole sort of this whole, um, experience visually Audi audibly as well, and the, and the emotion behind it. And I think like you mentioned that I. You need, you need that if you wanna have a memorable gig. And, um, there's a lot of planning that goes in, that's gonna be involved in that so I can see why it would take a bit of time to put it together. Yeah.

Zak Vortex:

I, but I early like a few shows maybe just around Bristol, I've sort of, I know people that own quite a few venues around Bristol, so it'd be quite easy to do something fairly low key. Not suggesting that I would do anything. That's not low key, but. I'd certainly go for something a little bit, uh, quiet to start with, just to test the water sort of thing.

Marc Matthews:

Yes. I, I would do the side, uh, most definitely. No, that's exciting, mate. Um, so Zach, we're coming to the awards, the end of the interview now. Um, so where can our audience find you online if they haven't found you already? Um,

Zak Vortex:

so if you go to. Forex records dot code UK there's there's links there to Z Forex and Chrome waves and merch and music and everything. Um, but is on, um, Instagram, the usual type of places really.

Marc Matthews:

Fantastic. And what I do is I'll put all that in. I put the links to those in the show notes as well for, for the audience to go and check out. So, mate, um, it's been great chatting to you again, as I said, that you were the very first, um, way back when, when the, when this podcast artist I remember. Yeah. So, yeah. Yeah. It's great to have you back on man. Um, and this success that I've seen over the last. The last year, probably what 14 months or so has, uh, has been amazing this Testament to your hard work. So, and I think what you've provided the audience today with your, with your behind the scenes sort of knowledge and just tips and tricks that they can use in terms of their releases is, is gonna proven invaluable. Um, so no big, thank you for joining me today. No

Zak Vortex:

problem. It's been a pleasure.

Marc Matthews:

Mark has always. Thanks mate. Well, I'll speak to you soon and, uh, enjoy the rest of your evening. Thank you. Speak soon. Cheers, Brad. Bye. Thank you for listening to our show. If you like what you're hearing, make sure to rate our show on apple podcasts.

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